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SCOTT

Penzance Ship’s Company stand to stand to?

Henry

Royal Monty Python – ITS JUST A FLESH WOUND

stephen ball

Do royal navy ships still paint silhouettes if they sunk/damaged ships?

Prop chief

Honestly we’re looking at mechanical failure here? That’s a bloody long stretch given that after ANY level of work on engines or ships systems, a basin trial is REQUIRED, which includes operating all propulsion and steering systems in all reversionary and normal modes of operation. Then, prior to putting to sea SAFR cards are conducted, the final card includes DMEOs propulsion and steering checks, with shaft confidence checks.
So…….. Are we saying that the propulsion system passed all of these checks, but failed on both shafts (the video shows both shaft behaving the same) in the same manor at the same time?
Or that none of the checks were done? (I know MCM have a reputation for being pirates, but even they shouldn’t have gone that low)
Or maybe, just maybe the person using the throttles (power demand levels) could have gone the wrong way?
As for control lock up…….the Hunts are over 40 years old. That was an issue of the old MCAS system and Deltic engines…… This has northrup grumund PMS control system with Caterpillar engines, so very unlikely….. Also both engines together at the same time?

I can see some arse covering happening here and controls getting blamed, as its easier and no one looses face.

Duker

Thanks for that

Gunbuster

The BOI report will be interesting. Lots of external factors aligning to make this happen as it did. A basin trial did happen

Coll

I assumed that it was the fault of the tug operators. (Link)

Last edited 1 month ago by Coll
AlexS

How can it be a fault of tug operators!?

Last edited 1 month ago by AlexS
Coll

Because there are two tugs on the port side. Why didn’t they pull the ship away? That’s what I was assuming.

Prop chief

Tugs do as they are instructed, it’s not up to them guess what’s going in and react. If they purposely drive chid into Bangor, then it’d be more likely their fault….. But not stopping something that happened quite fast isn’t their fault.

AlexS

There are incidents and incidents, This one is particularly difficult to explain. How the propulsion system and controls were not checked?

Wil

No ‘major’ work is done to vessels alongside at HMS Jufair, it’s done at the repair facility ASRY. In my experience, I never once saw the RN mine hunter vessels use tugs to leave or get alongside..
So what am I saying? Nice try Navy Lookout

Gunbuster

Not true.
There is no HMS Jufair.
Work on a lot of RN vessels is conducted alongside in UKNSF using FSU and external contractors be they UK or in Bahrain.
ASRY hasn’t worked on a UK MCMV for well over 12 months. That work has been done by the other local shipyard, BASREC of late. ASRY has been concentrating of USN units.

Vessels in ASRY do use tugs provided by ASRY especially when alongside on the berths at the slipway area.

In UKNSF its Bahrain port authority tugs that are used.

Duker

This gives an aerial view of the repair yard
https://www.asry.net/

Gunbuster

Now do it for BASREC.

Sean

There’s photos taken from the other side that show the tugs involved in the incident. Several people here have posted links to them.

Last edited 1 month ago by Sean
Gunbuster

HMS Bangor did not have a particularly good weekend.

Prop chief

No, it really doesn’t look good for her. It’s certainly one way to shutdown Sandown operations!

Last edited 1 month ago by Prop chief
Phillip Johnson

I think you can write off Bangor.
As to what happens to the hull it is actually quite hard to get rid of fibre reinforced plastic. It is a very robust building material, it might get brittle but otherwise it will last a long, long time.
You could find that this is quite an expensive accident to clean up.

Roger Phelps

Just grind it up and use it as a concrete additive

Clive Hannam

The glass fibres used in GRP production are a different composition to fibres intended for concrete re-inforcement and react badly when exposed to the PH values of concrete.

Steve

I dont know whats more embarrassing, the ships colliding or seeing that one ship is made of plywood. Wouldnt even need a torpedo to sink that, a spud gun would do it.

Nick

They are mine hunters, made from plastic and wood so not to detonate magnetic mines in their vicinity.

Prop chief

Are you alright?
You seem to not have processed anything that was written or understand the role of a MCM.
They are GRP ships with the internal fittings constructed from wood. It’s all about magnetic signature. The chidingfold is 40 years old…… Pretty good for any hull!

Supportive Bloke

Made of very high quality resin, for the time.

There some ‘debates’ about timber being included under the fire glass layers, for stiffening, due to rotting risk. Actually it was more about shaping the fibreglass ribs so high density foam would have done. Also about attachment points.

I think the engine bolt downs were supposed to be to elm?

Some brighter spark thought carbon fibre, then v expensive, was a good idea until it was pointed out it was conductive.

Gunbuster

I have worked doing maintenance and dockings on UK and US MCMVs. With the UK ones, both Hunts and Sandowns I have never seen rotten wood. The hulls when blasted are pristine with little if any osmosis even after decades of use.

USN vessels are all wood and there are usually patch repairs required of some description for rotted out areas in the deck or structure where water has gotten under the paint.

Hunts had hand lay up in the moulds, so the hulls are thick. Sandowns where vacuum SCRIM lay up so the hulls are thinner but of a more uniform thickness and have uniform resin depth through the layers of matting.

AlexS

I dont know whats more embarrassing, the ships colliding or seeing that one ship is made of plywood. Wouldnt even need a torpedo to sink that, a spud gun would do it.

I think you will be surprised that a 12.7 mm machine gun can sink any surface combatant today if enough round fired. Or do you you think the hull thickness in them are more than 10mm?

David MacDonald

Whether the event was due to a mechanical failure or a failure of seamanship (or it bit of both) it is highly embarrassing and requires a full investigation, not only of the event itself but also of the failures in management and training which allowed it to happen.

Lyndon Scanlon

Very true, this incident should be thoroughly investigated and the results published.

The Scallywags

Skimmers always let the RN down

Prop chief

*Cough* Tireless *cough* Superb *cough * Trafalgar *cough* Vanguard
All spring to mind 😉

Taff H

Looks like a promotion to a desk simetime in the near future for the captain!!

John sztucki

So was it bodgit and scarpa doing the maintenance work or was it kaptin mohusband in charge ????????

Simon

Landlubber here, a ship would not intentionally move off at full speed ahead? In this case in reverse.

Prop chief

No, it would normally engage a fairly slow ahead speed to get going (more if wind or tide necessities), which is what may have happened here….. But in reverse.
As soon as the OOW realised they were going backwards, they may have increased the speed to attempt to move forwards and stop moving towards Bangor.
As a last resort a full ahead (or astern) order will be used to inform the SCC /MCR that there is an urgent situation and it should be obeyed to the fullest ability of the machinery.
If you watch the video, it does look like this sequence of events happened….. Just astern, not ahead.
Why is still for investigation……I obviously question the trials that should have unearthed and mechanical issues, but it’s still possible…… As is moving the levers the wrong way in a panic.
They are both possible.

Theoden

Not related sorry but Naval News has an article on Norway seeks international partners for Future Frigate’ very interesting ! !

Greta Thunderpants

UK might be in the same Market….. soon.

Richard

Perhaps ship should be used by Reserves to intercept the amazingly large amounts of illegal agents and Military age males landing on UK beaches??

Greta Thunderpants

But we are not allowed to say such things nowadays…… people get all offended.

Prop chief

No, saying such things is just plain stupid. On what planet should military ships be attacking unarmed civilians crossing a sea? I mean if your on a page like this, I assume your broadly supportive of our forces and all the sacrifice they have made in the face of tyrants and dictators?
So in what way should the military and it’s ships be helping in your opinion? Or is it actually an ill considered remark steaming from a fear of immigrants stoked by a devisive media?

Greta Thunderpants

And the Offended have turned up !

Last edited 28 days ago by Greta Thunderpants
D B

If you’re seriously advocating shooting dinghies in the middle of the channel, you’re a rampant idiot. I don’t think it’s being offended to point that out.

Sean

And what would these Reserves in a old mine-warfare vessel do on this “intercept”
(a) machine-gun them to death – as has been suggested previously in comments here, a practice known internationally as “murder”
(b) push them back to France and risk infringing French territorial waters and a showdown with the French Navy
(c) rescue them and bring them to the U.K. shore for processing – as is done by Border Force.

BTW – they’re not all “military age males” nor are they “agents”. Are you one of those fantasists that thinks they’re an army being smuggled here by the WEF to launch a coup against HMG….?

Prop chief

There seem to be an alarming amount of alleged veterans and supporters who are calling for the murder of unarmed people at the moment.
Use of the term ‘fighting age male’ just means anyone from 18 to 50.
Personally I’d love to see less people crossing in boats….. It’s a sh***y way to get to the UK and there is more chance of going outside the law. I just wish the government had legitimate routes to apply outside of landing on beaches!

Sean

I’m glad you said “alleged veterans” as I would hope and expect any veterans to have higher ethics than to advocate murder.
Alas the use of the terms “fighting age male” and “agents” are common among conspiracy theorists who claim the WEF are trying to smuggle a foreign army into the U.K. These are the same people who believe 5G caused Corvid-19, that vaccines are bioweapons, and that Putin is civilisation’s saviour…

Agreed, for valid, legitimate asylum seekers better system is required. Those that do then seek to circumvent our borders can then be sent straight to detention camp and then deported.

Last edited 29 days ago by Sean
Greta Thunderpants

Offended and deluded.

Last edited 28 days ago by Greta Thunderpants
Esteban

Think before you speak.

Sean

Thought, a concept alien to yourself.

daniel

France here.
Sean.

Your (b): Yeah! Trafalgar or Mers el Kebir all over again with a good chance for us to win!
Nah, I’m dreaming. Bad dream. Thanks anyway…

I think it’s safe to say that you have nothing to fear from the French Navy. Aren’t we allies? And what’s more, by the time our navy wakes up, you’ll be long gone. At most, there will be work for diplomats 3 months after the events. And then you risk nothing: our diplomacy is dead.

daniel

Russian sabir is not mine. It must be dangerous to point at it.

D B

Military age males? Isn’t there a shortage at the moment? Sounds like a match made in heaven… already demonstrated resilience too! You’re a genius.

Jonno

I think you can see the prop wash continuing going astern or maybe the Captain is a BMW owner.

Navaleye

Its not a collision as only one vessel was under way. Its an allision

Last edited 30 days ago by Navaleye
Longbedsocks

Where was Commander Colin Hamilton? ;-D

Steve hale

All speculation as ever