HMS Prince of Wales arrived in Liverpool on 1st December and this morning became the RN Flagship, taking over from HMS Queen Elizabeth.
The new fleet flagship arrived on the Mersey a day ahead of schedule due to the inclement weather forecast for today. Her visit will allow her 800 crew to engage with local schools, community projects, civic leaders and host the public on board. Demonstrating the huge public interest in the aircraft carriers, 20,000 tickets to visit the ship had all gone within 6 hours of being made available.
In preparation for becoming the high readiness carrier, HMS Prince of Wales participated in 2-week exercise Strike Warrior in early November. Further training will be conducted in UK waters before the Carrier Strike Group deploys in 2025.
The two carriers offer the UK continuous carrier capability and the flagship title will rotate between them over the years, with one ready to deploy at short notice while the other is in routine maintenance. The CSG25 deployment will see HMS Prince of Wales head to the Asia-Pacific region next year, a long-planned voyage that has strong political backing from the new government. Despite a vociferous campaign against them in the media, the carriers are unlikely to be axed in the defence review next year. Their capital costs have already been paid and their running cost is small in comparison with their vast potential.
The aircraft carriers are a key component of NATO maritime capability and HMS Queen Elizabeth will be kept at readiness while her sister ship is out of the NATO area. In the event of a crisis in Europe, the air group could be flown back to the UK to embark on HMS Queen Elizabeth. There is also a NATO aircraft carriers working group that loosely coordinates the deployment of the UK, French, Italian and US carriers.
HMS Queen Elizabeth is due to be dry docked in Rosyth for her first refit and Lloyds-mandated hull certification survey later in 2025. It should be noted that BAE Systems’ new support model is designed to reduce the time that ships spend in dry dock, with an approach more in line with commercial ship repair practices. General ship maintenance is being de-coupled from underwater work and has been spread evenly over the last six years. This approach will reduce the length of what would previously have been a major refit.
How many F35bs do we now have in service. I ask only to be informed.
Currently something like 37, Full delivery of first tranche of 48 by end of 2025. SDR will decide if we get the 72 previously committed to.
Thanks.
In an operational context:
” As of July 29, 2024, there were 26 F-35B aircraft in operational service at RAF Marham”.
To me that does not seem yet quite sufficient for 617 squadron, 809 Naval Air Squadron and the OCU.
Perhaps. But the ‘modern’ RAF approach is to have a station pool of planes rather than have any allocated for squadrons.
What are the chances of having 24 F35s onboard?
They’ve said they want to achieve that before but would be a stretch and leave very little at home
Would have been much cheaper in long run to have had steam catapult on the ship s as the carrier f35 is much cheaper and to run it’s so sad because we invented the steam catapult system
Steam catapults powered by what steam? EMALS, perhaps…
Way too many, our bases are not able to handle the sheer quantity and the carriers are dangerously overloaded. Don’t worry though, Labour will realise this and make some drastic cuts soon.
A false claim of ‘overloading’.
The hangar alone can take 20 F-35B comfortably , probably more if some are reserves close packed.
The deck could easily take another 12
The USN did an exercise with 16 F35B on one of its much smaller LHA
Pretty sure Georgie was being sarcastic there, Duker.
Check the last sentence.
Likely to be an unpopular view but wouldn’t we be better with one carrier active and the other one in reserve/maintenance/refit?
We don’t have enough F35’s or AEW Merlins for two full air groups or enough escorts for two carrier strike groups. The air group is also limited in its usefulness for the next few years until the F35 has a stand off weapon.
Meanwhile, we’re retiring useful assets such as frigates, LPD’s and MCM’s due to insufficient crews. Keeping one carrier operational and the other in reserve would surely go a long way to solving the crew shortage issue.
That’s exactly the plan. The carriers are just so new they’re able to operate together but like the article states HMSQNLZ will undergo her first refit next year, leaving only HMSPWLS in service.
Putting a carrier in long term reserve results in 1 being overworked and the other rotting like Albion and Bulwark
Be interesting to see do they go through the Suez and Red Sea next year. Bit different there from when Lizzie went through. Don’t want to be like the Germans and go the long way. Hopefully a couple of t45s etc will give a good screen and they also have phalanx mounted and active.
Hopefully better for the crew too without covid restrictions on shore. Have not seen if they will do a detour to Sidney or similar. That be awesome especially with AUKUS.
Is is smaller than Panamax? What about a LA visit too?
Much to wide at flight deck level.
The new wider Panama canal locks ( 180 ft ) can accommodate a Nimitz and Ford class for waterline beam but its the side sponsons as the water level falls(52 ft) that become the issue.
The QEC are 128 ft waterline beam but I dont know the sponson width – the flight deck is wider again
https://www.usni.org/magazines/proceedings/2008/september/special-panama-canal-new-century-wider-speedier-busier
Superblock during construction shows sponsons might fit within 180ft dock width
Its 30m or 100ft from keel to flight deck
Looking at satellite photos of the locks there are a heap of big light poles close to the lock edge. I suspect they would definitely get in the way. These locks were clearly designed for modern “slab sided” commercial vessels not carriers.
Yes. That is so for the older docks. The neomax docks seem to be clearer.
Not all commercial vessels are completely slab sided
The ACP or canal authority has highly detailed requirements for passage, right down to display of the Panama flag, but overhang width is said to be ‘case by case’
I can’t see the value in these when neither can be adequately loaded with an air wing.
In the eventuality of another ‘Falklands’ scenario any task group cobbled together would find itself wanting and vulnerable. This is further exacerbated by CIW systems. They should be more than adequate given the reliance placed on this platform to provide force projection.
https://derbosoft.proboards.com/thread/1790/aircraft-carriers-mersey
Interesting to look at previous visits
Going before Xmas? Wish the crew all the best hopefully a good experience and port stops.
I’m curious as to why the PoW has been named flagship instead of the QE. Elizabeth is the “ older sister” and the lead ship of the class.
It says in the story